Timestamps

00:00:00: Introduction
00:01:05: What is feedback and why does it matter?
00:03:33: Idea for action 1: clear is kind
00:04:58: Idea for action 2: strength spotting
00:05:57: Go-to guru
00:06:05: Relevant podcast episode
00:06:13: Final thoughts

Interview Transcription

Helen Tupper: Hi, I'm Helen.

Sarah Ellis: And I'm Sarah.

Helen Tupper: And you're listening to the Squiggly Careers podcast, and this episode is part of our Squiggly Skills Sprint Series, where we've recorded 20 episodes, each of them are less than seven minutes long, to help you build some career development momentum.  In each episode, Sarah and I are going to talk about a Squiggly Skill, what it is and why it matters; we're going to share an idea for action from each of us; give you a go-to guru and a podcast episode, so that you can listen and learn a bit more.  And we really, really want you to turn this Squiggly Skills Sprint into your own learning streak. 

For anyone who lets us know how they're getting on, and who completes the 20-day streak, we can't prove that so we trust you; but if you tag us that you've done the sprint, you've completed the streak, then what we will do is we'll get in touch with you and we will invite you to a free Five Skills to Succeed virtual workshop that Sarah and I are going to be running in September, so we can help you dive even deeper into the world of Squiggly Careers.  All you've got to do is tag @amazingif in any of your social posts, and then we'll be in touch. 

Sarah Ellis: So this Skill Sprint is on feedback.  So, we're going to start with what it is and why does it matter?  And the, what it is, is interesting because there is very rarely a shared understanding in organisations or even in teams, of what feedback is for.  If you ask everybody to share a definition of feedback, you usually get lots of different versions.  One of my favourites is "actionable insight" because I think that's short, it's memorable and it describes in a simple and straightforward way what feedback is for. 

I think when you're thinking about feedback, see the sort of mini skills that sit under feedback, which is asking for feedback, giving feedback and receiving feedback.  Again, I think sometimes our capability isn't the same across those three almost sub-skills to do with feedback.  So, if you were thinking about those three, Helen, which one are you best at, asking, giving or receiving feedback? 

Helen Tupper: Oh, that's a really interesting question.  I think that I am best at receiving feedback, I reflect on it for quite a lot afterwards.  I try very hard not to respond in the moment because I think you can become quite defensive.  And I think the area that I could improve upon is giving feedback, varying it with different people; that's always a bit of a work in progress for me. 

Sarah Ellis: Oh, I think I'd be the opposite.  So we should probably just learn from each other.

Helen Tupper: Help each other out!

Sarah Ellis: Given that we're both here!  And actually, one of the things I think helped me with giving feedback is, I think I've had jobs where part of my job has been to give a lot of feedback, particularly on work, you know, on projects or on creative work.  I think I've got good at understanding how do you deliver that feedback in a really specific way, because general feedback is so frustrating.  It's like, "Oh, you just need to improve your profile in this organisation", and everyone just goes, "Oh, but how do I do that?  What does that look like?"  So I think the more specific you can be, the better. 

The other idea that I think is really helpful on feedback is the difference between intent and impact.  So, your intent is how you want to show up.  So I might think, well, I want to be known for being creative, strategic, and building brilliant relationships.  That's what I'd like everyone to see and maybe to say about me when I'm not in the room.  The only way I will know whether my impact is what I would intend it to be is by asking for feedback.  And that's really what self-awareness is, when we sort of understand ourselves, but we also understand how other people see us too; where have we got overlaps, which is always a good thing, we're looking for consistency here; and where have we got gaps.  And even though you might be disappointed or surprised by those gaps, much better to know and to do something about them than to not know. 

Helen Tupper: And that actually links really nicely into my one idea for action that I would recommend, which is the idea, which is taken from Radical Candor, of "clear is kind".  So, Radical Candor is Kim Scott's work, and what she talks about are these two dimensions of what good feedback looks like, so it's when we challenge directly and we care personally, and you can sit in lots of different places on this. 

So for example, I often care personally, but I'm not very good at challenging directly, which means that some of my messages that might be quite important for people can come across as a bit wishy-washy, they're quite hard for people to act on.  It actually gets called by Kim Scott, ruinous empathy.  So, it's like my niceness gets in the way of other people's growth.  And the thing to really remember, and this is the stuff that you really want to stick, is that clear is kind.  If you are talking to someone about the work they do well, just be really clear about what that is.  If there's something that you think is getting in the way of their growth, just deliver that message, even if it feels really difficult, because you're going to make a much bigger difference to someone's development over time if you can approach it as clear is kind.

Sarah Ellis: Also, if you think of the opposite, unclear is unkind, that can be quite motivating; none of us want to be unkind.  Someone once said that to me.  They were like, "Well, somebody can't get better unless you've given them that very clear feedback", and you can't expect them to get better unless you've given it either.  It's almost like holding yourself to account for sometimes those, what can feel like quite difficult conversations.  Still have to take a deep breath, but I do think it helps you to do it in a way that feels right for you. 

My idea for action is strength spotting.  So, I would love to see and to hear loads more strength spotting in organisations.  So this will sound like, "That was brilliant, because I really appreciated how you…", three words to describe you at your best.  We've got loads of examples we can share about what strength spotting sounds like, but essentially it's just going beyond positive praise and to see in the positive praise, what was it that made it so good; because if you signal people's strengths to them, it gives them that positive boost, but also it means that sometimes you can see someone's strengths more clearly than they can see it for themselves.  And also you're helping somebody to make their strength stronger. 

So, if Helen says to me, "Oh, actually, I think you're really good at writing those presentations in a really clear way, I think you've got some very strong copywriting skills", I might think, "Oh, I didn't really appreciate those about myself".  And so suddenly, then I can think, "Well, how do I make that strength stronger?"  So asking, giving, receiving lots more strengths-based feedback. 

Helen Tupper: And our go-to guru, we've already mentioned her name, but we'll say it again, Kim Scott for all of her work on Radical Candor.  You can also listen to a conversation Sarah had on the podcast with her.  And to listen and learn a bit more, episode 301 of the Squiggly Careers podcast is How to Give Fast and Frequent Feedback. 

Sarah Ellis: Thank you for listening to this Skills Sprint.  We hope you found it useful.  We'd love you to share and subscribe so you don't miss a sprint.  And that's everything for this episode.  So bye for now.

Helen Tupper: Bye everyone.